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Unread 05-29-2007, 11:56 PM   #1
rec9140
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Default Dial Plans

After some great guidance here....I've got some understanding of the dial plans..

What I am after is what kind of dial plans others have to :

1) Route international calls (I'm in the US) ie: If want to dial a number in the UK I should hit 44 then the number (dial plan will add extra dialing digits)

2) Is there something in Voxalots that you can "trap" a number to a fast busy or unable to complete tone or message ie: In the US 900-nxx-yyyy and NPA-976-xxxx and NPA-540-xxxx could be expensive calls. While I doubt any VOIPSP is going to complete them, I would like to put my own equivalent block on them ie: _1900xxxxxxx then some code to trigger the unable to complete or similar. Or work for any number I want to block on the line. Like trapping _911 and it plays a recodring to find a real phone or some thing to that effect. (I already have a nice big sticker on the phone regarding this.)


I've got my local area code down to normal 7 digit dialing and interlata calls back to 10 digit dialing via the dial plan, and would like to do this with international calls so that I dial country code then number ie: 44203xxxxx and I get my London DID sames goes with any other country (country code)number, no 00, or 011 or other wasted POTS based digits. The dial plan will add back the wasted digits as needed for the carrier rules.

Any way to do this with out turning this into a nightmare to support and maintain.
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Unread 05-30-2007, 09:06 AM   #2
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1). This is similar to what you already have for your local number. eg.
(Assuming that the UK number is 8 digits and you are using a UK VSP)
Patern: _44xxxxxxxx
Replacement: 00${EXTEN}
Optional ENUM Replacement: ${EXTEN}

2). I think this can be achived by making sure that the undesirable number will not be trapped by the Dial Plan.
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Unread 06-01-2007, 04:36 AM   #3
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Depending on whether you set up to emulate North American dialling or international dialling, you can set up a dial plan entry toward the top of your dialling plan to send the numbers you want to block to a number that results in a busy signal or a message.

For example :
Patern: _1900xxxxxx. or _001900xxxxxx.
Replacement: *01055555 (Non-valid Voxalot number)
Provider: Sipbroker
ENUM/Geographic Replacements: No

This replacement reults in a message "We are sorry ......"
Alternately, you can send the call to an (unregistered) provider with no credit which results in a fast busy tone usually.

Some other replacement numbers you can try using, again via Sipbroker:
*258902 (Busy tone)
*266300 (Don't get too carried away with this one ......)

Note that the pattern test is for the full length of the number with the last character being a wildcard. This is to remove the possibility of the check being bypassed by adding an extra character.
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Unread 06-01-2007, 11:21 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kurun View Post
Depending on whether you set up to emulate North American dialling or international dialling, you can set up a dial plan entry toward the top of your dialling plan to send the numbers you want to block to a number that results in a busy signal or a message.
I consider the numbering plan to be a flat space, thus there are digits that are wasted in dialing.

I don't want to go too deep into it, as I have a very strong opinion on this and its not entirely relevant to this, expect that I despise extra digits like 1-xxx-xxxx just to dial a call in my area code because its considered LD.

I set things up so you dial
NANPA - NPANXXyyyy dials a 10 digit NANPA number
- NXXyyyy dials a number in the same area code

Same should happen for outher countries as well.

(countrycode)number ie:
4420315xxxx

No 00, 011, 1 or other wasted telco digits.

Whats happening on the back end of things to make it work for carriers is another thing. ENUM sorta has the same theory for its look ups

(countrycode)number

VOIP should not carry over the mistakes of the telcos to its dialing mechanism just to keep people who probably shouldn't have VOIP any way happy. Like I said I have a very strong opinion on dialing mechanisms.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kurun View Post
This replacement reults in a message "We are sorry ......"
Alternately, you can send the call to an (unregistered) provider with no credit which results in a fast busy tone usually.

Some other replacement numbers you can try using, again via Sipbroker:
*258902 (Busy tone)
*266300 (Don't get too carried away with this one ......)

Note that the pattern test is for the full length of the number with
Thanks, I'll play with these to get things worked out. Thats what I needed was what numbers would generate busy, fast busy, messages.
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Unread 06-01-2007, 11:43 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rec9140 View Post
VOIP should not carry over the mistakes of the telcos to its dialing mechanism just to keep people who probably shouldn't have VOIP any way happy.
Agreed, that does make a lot of sense. It is much more intuitive to just dial a country code then an area code. I have found that most VoIP suppliers will accept the number without 00 anyway.

The 0 was traditionally used to distinguish local numbers starting with digits 1-9 from national numbers and then 00 to distinguish international numbers without having to wait and see how many digits were dialled.

Removing the 00 would help with using these phone numbers with computer programs like Excel which will get rid of the 00 unless you format the cell correctly.
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Unread 06-02-2007, 02:12 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomblandford View Post
Agreed, that does make a lot of sense. It is much more intuitive to just dial a country code then an area code. I have found that most VoIP suppliers will accept the number without 00 anyway.

The 0 was traditionally used to distinguish local numbers starting with digits 1-9 from national numbers and then 00 to distinguish international numbers without having to wait and see how many digits were dialled.

Removing the 00 would help with using these phone numbers with computer programs like Excel which will get rid of the 00 unless you format the cell correctly.
Some perspective ... in the US, at least in my area Pittbsurgh, Pennsylvania in the NPA 412 till splits with NPA's etc... You could pick up the phone...

Dial NPA-NXX-yyyy and the call went thru didn't matter if it was 800-123-4567, 202-555-1212, etc... same goes for pick up the phone dial NXX-yyyy and the call went thru... None of this blathering about the "You must first dial a 1....."

When I moved/and commuted back and forth from/to West Virginia, the entire state is ONE area code 304, and thus all this 1-NXX-yyyy and some times even 1-304-nxx-yyyy. RUBBISH!

FLorida has this same crap...Same NPA and the witch comes on and "You must first dial a 1....."

Getting to the chase... the whole point of this crap is get the clueless dolts to understand that its a LD call... and some die hard telco guys and I got into it hot over this BS. Its not really relevant to me wether the call is LD or not, about issue with switching etc... Well if Bell of PA in the 80's and 90's before all the new NPA's could figure out how to route it then the rest of the switches in my opinion were FUBAR'D! Like I said I don't wont dwell on this too much as I could rant on this subject alone for quite a while. Suffice it to say its a REALLY SORE POINT with me.

Your post also shed some light on why UK numbers all that 0 at the front...

I guess the whole deal of wasted digits just irks me to death, and your Excel example is a good example of an issue as well. Maybe I just think the same as Excel (scary) and feel that 0 is a waste.

Getting back to the real topic on this, I guess the only real way to set this up is to do a rule for every country code ? ? ? Hmmm.... that seems like a lot of rules I guess I was looking for a way to resolve this with a handful versus a whole slew of them. Maybe when I go full blown */Trixbox....
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Unread 06-03-2007, 08:11 AM   #7
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The original US dialling system (well before the introduction of the "1") checked to see whether the second digit was a 1 or a 0. If it was then the call was long distance (or special services 411, 911, etc.). When they ran out of area codes it was decided to allow use any number as the second digit but that meant they needed some way to determine if the number was LD or not - hence add the 1 in front. However I agree with you - they seemed to have messed it up completely!

In the case of the UK for LD they decided to set up relatively small area codes (towns/small regions) each with, originally, two, three or four digit area codes alway begining with 0. eg: 01 London, 021 Birmingham, 0734 Reading. No local numbers begin with 0 (or 1). When international dialling was first introduced they routed all calls through London and used an international access code of 010, ie London code plus another zero. Nowadays they use 00 as the international access code.

Most (?) European countries use a leading 0 call another area code and 00 as an international call indicator. Also some calls can be charged as local calls even though you have to dial an area code to get there.

Here, in Australia, we have the crazy situation where two thirds of the continent is covered by a single area code (08). This encompasses Western Australia, South Australia and Northern Territory and Australia is approx the same size as the US! So from Perth (where I live) I can call Darwin or Adelaide without dialling any area code (Adelaide is about 2500 kilometers away and Darwin about 4000 kilometers!). We have two digit area codes, beginning with 0, and have to dial 0011 for international.

All good fun I guess!

Alan
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Unread 06-03-2007, 01:44 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jenalcom View Post
The original US dialling system (well before the introduction of the "1") checked to see ........needed some way to determine if the number was LD or not - hence add the 1 in front. However I agree with you - they seemed to have messed it up completely!
I've been rather intimiate with the foibles of the NANPA for work reasons, but can't say that I agree with some of the "ASSUMumptions" made for it. Telco people insisted that even before the split you needed that 1 for switching purposes... BZZZTT! Bell of PA NEVER NEEDED IT. I could pick up any Bell of PA phone dial 800-456-7890 and it went thru quite fine. Same with 415-123-4567, or 786-1234 (if it were a toll call) I never dialed a 1 just because it was a interlata or intralata toll call. I spent 20+ years not needing to do this, except when I travelled and dialed a call and the witch came on and I had to remember I was in an area that had FUBAR'd swithces. And this was LONG before the NPA splits were needed. Maybe the old SxS switching couldn't handle things correctly, but once modern switching was in place there was simply no need for it. Alot of telco peolpe and some users insist that a 1 be required because they want to know its LD due to the $$ at that time. Since thats not relevant to me, since if I needed to make the call then I needed to pay for it.

The whole dialing scheme in the US is FUBAR'D for a lot reasons from NPA splits, overlays, and to ACCOMODATE STUPID USERS. 10 digit dialing just because theres and overlay. NO. If you dial 123-4567 then thats different than 789-123-4567. Pretty simple to understand if you ask me, but the telco guys flip out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jenalcom View Post
In the case of the UK for LD they .......plus another zero. Nowadays they use 00 as the international access code.
I don't even try to understand UK and EU numbers, I just consider it all one big blob, I just can wrap my brain around things like variable length area codes. Just doesn't sink in. Too many years with NANPA. Add non geogrpahic number schemes, "mobile/cell" numbers at higher pricing and my head spins more. While some of this is similar to 900 NPA, 540 & 976 NXX's in the US, most of this never caught on and its died off. I don't even then the old 700 NPA sort of a US non geographic number that ATT came up with is even in use, but I could be wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jenalcom View Post
Also some calls can be charged as local calls even though you have to dial an area code to get there.
You have that in the US or any NANPA area with "10 Digit" dialing. In areas where they overlay an new NPA then you have to dial NPA-NXX-yyyy to get ALL NUMBERS even in the same NPA. I find that stupid. Your willing to cater to stupid users on this 1 toll call thing, but you want to change the rules due to a NPA overlay. Just consider it a flat space and your done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jenalcom View Post
Here, in Australia, we have the crazy situation where two thirds of the continent is covered by a single area code (08). This encompasses Western Australia, South Australia and Northern Territory and Australia is approx the same size as the US! So from Perth (where I live) I can call Darwin or Adelaide without dialling any area code (Adelaide is about 2500 kilometers away and Darwin about 4000 kilometers!).
We have similar situations in the US, but probably not for long. Many of the Western states like Arizona, Montanna, Wyoming, Idaho etc. Had ONE area code for the ENTIRE STATE covered a pretty sizeable area for places like Montanna and Wyoming... The need for numbers has caused splits in some of these but WY, ID, ND, MT are all still single NPA's for the entire state.

To me if an number is in the same area code, then I should only dial 7 digits or what ever is the length in that area be it 7 plus or minus.

NOT in the US.... One the OLD DRACONIAN Rate Centers still live on in most areas unless your on a calling plan or had what was called in many areas "Metro Service." Your local exchanges could be dialed with 7 digits, and then any thing outside that rate center was a intralata toll call and thus needed 1-NXX-yyyy,URRRGH! , this held true for most areas EXCEPT Bell of PA, which I never could get answer as to why Bell PA was set up this way and no where else was.
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Unread 06-04-2007, 02:55 AM   #9
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Thanks for the historical and factual information on the different dialling modes.

I can appreciate the frustration with having to dial non-value adding characters (in particular, leading 1's or 0's, or combinations there of).

I have set up my dial plan to emulate a local PSTN setup such that a user off the street could use my phone without being able to tell that they are using a VoIP connection.

In addition, I have also set it up to accept the shortest dialling modes for local or long distance (10 digit dialling due to overlays), international calling, and European style "00 + Country Code + etc".

This is the best compromise, I think.
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Unread 06-04-2007, 05:23 AM   #10
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I think there was also a clear difference in the design philosophy of the telephone systems between the US and the UK.

The UK system used a thing called a translator to take your area code and convert it to routing digits that sent it to the right destination - sometimes direct, sometimes through various other switches. Plus the full number "local" number was sent with the routing digits. If the route was full then tough, the call didn't go through.

The US system worked differently in that the originating switch would only send the area code through the system preferably direct to the final area code. If that route was full it would send the area code to another area code switch which would then try and send it to where it needed to go. So the request would get passed from area to area until finally it landed in the right area. At that time the destination switch would request the "local" part of the number. Quite a clever system really with lots of redundancy routing built in.

Before LD dialling in the UK you could access other (relatively close) areas by dialling the routing digits yourself. These usually began with a "9" and could be as many as 5 or 6 digits long to get to a further away exchange/switch. These routing digits were published for subscribers to use. There were a lot more that were not published that could be used if you were in the know. For instance it was possible to dial from the UK to Australia for the cost of a local call if you dialled the correct codes! 4 pence (approx 10 cents) for as long as you wanted! But then you could do that in the US as well with the help of a "blue (?) box".

The UK LD area codes were originally based on the alpha characters on the dial/keypad. Or at least the three and four digit ones were. The main centres had short codes - 01=London, 021=Birmingham, 031=Edinburgh, 041=Glasgow, 051=Liverpool, 061=Manchester. Luckily the six main area names fitted with the dial/key allocations! The other areas mainly used similar dialling conventions - Reading was 0734 (0RE4), Horsham was 0408 (0HO8), etc.

I never really got into the European area codes but I suspect that most of them were base on a "routing code" system where the short codes were major centres and the longer codes were fed from those centres.

All in all fascinating stuff.

Alan
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